Format 14 cmap subtable

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BabelStone
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Format 14 cmap subtable

Postby BabelStone » Wed Nov 25, 2009 2:11 pm

FontCreator version 6 supports the new "Unicode Variation Sequences" encoding (Platform 0 Encoding 5) in as much as you can add the encoding to a font, and it will recognise if a font has this encoding (as two Windows 7 fonts do). However, FontCreator does not appear to support the new Format 14 cmap subtable (Unicode Variation Sequences) which is the only subtable that can be used with Platform 0 Encoding 5.

Windows 7 expects Unicode variation sequences to be encoded in a Format 14 subtable, and so in order to update my Phags-pa font to work under Windows 7 I need to add a Format 14 subtable for Phags-pa variation sequences. Therefore, would it be possible for you to add support for the Format 14 subtable as a matter of urgency.

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Re: Format 14 cmap subtable

Postby William » Sat Nov 28, 2009 5:09 pm

Firstly, I am not in any way a representative of High-Logic, I am just an interested participant in this forum.

Could you possibly provide an example, as a sequence of Unicode characters, of what you are trying to achieve please?

William Overington

28 November 2009

Erwin Denissen
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Re: Format 14 cmap subtable

Postby Erwin Denissen » Sun Nov 29, 2009 8:30 pm

We have no short term plans to add support for this subtable, but if we receive more similar requests we might change our plans.
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Re: Format 14 cmap subtable

Postby BabelStone » Mon Nov 30, 2009 1:26 pm

Thanks for the reply. It is basically what I expected you would say. I think that the only solution will be for me to write a little utility to add in a format 14 subtable to a font.

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Re: Format 14 cmap subtable

Postby William » Mon Nov 30, 2009 5:54 pm

Erwin Denissen wrote:We have no short term plans to add support for this subtable, but if we receive more similar requests we might change our plans.


I have been thinking about this and wonder if I may comment please.

Firstly some facts.

Erwin is running a business. I am not running a business. I think that I would not be able to run a business.

I do like progress. I like the idea that the person who started this thread is, if I may put it this way, reaching for the stars and making progress and I like to encourage people reaching for the stars and trying to make progress.

I wonder as to how many more similar requests would need to be received and I wonder whether if the task were done then some more people might start to use FontCreator as a result of the new capability becoming available.

Yet I do appreciate that I am not running a business.

So I have tried to think of a solution and wonder if there is some way that FontCreator could have a system of plug-ins, like Adobe Photoshop has plug-ins. I sometimes use Photoshop plug-ins even though I do not have Photoshop, because there are also budget programs, such as Serif PhotoPlus, that can use some Photoshop plug-ins.

In that way, a thread such as this one could, instead of simply ending, become a discussion amongst interested participants in this forum and maybe, just maybe, the code for the plug-in could be produced as a discussion group effort.

To me, and I do emphasise that I am not running a business and thus not needing to have the same priorities as someone who is running a business, it is not important how many people want the Unicode Variation Sequences facility, to me what matters is that an attempt is being made to produce progress and I like progress to happen.

So, having written the above, I hope that something can come of it.

William Overington

30 November 2009

BabelStone
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Re: Format 14 cmap subtable

Postby BabelStone » Tue Nov 09, 2010 2:08 pm

Erwin Denissen wrote:We have no short term plans to add support for this subtable, but if we receive more similar requests we might change our plans.


Please would you reconsider. I think that Font Creator is an excellent font editor, but the lack of support for Format 14 cmap subtable is really holding me back. This table is required for fonts that want to support Unicode variation sequences, currently used for Han ideographs, Phags-pa script and some maths characters. Microsoft has two fonts shipped with Windows 7 that support this subtable (Cambria Math and Microsoft PhagsPa), and independant font developers are now also beginning to produce fonts with this subtable (e.g. HanaMin, a Japanese font which has support for thousands of ideographic variation sequences using the Format 14 cmap subtable). I want to add some ideographic variation sequences to a CJK font that I am developing, and cannot do this with Font Creator unless you add support for the Format 14 cmap subtable.

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Re: Format 14 cmap subtable

Postby Erwin Denissen » Tue Nov 09, 2010 4:23 pm

We will most likely add support for this subtable as soon as we start adding support for OpenType layout features, but we are currently focused on a major update of MainType.
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Re: Format 14 cmap subtable

Postby BabelStone » Wed Nov 10, 2010 8:46 pm

Erwin Denissen wrote:We will most likely add support for this subtable as soon as we start adding support for OpenType layout features, but we are currently focused on a major update of MainType.


Thanks, I'm eagerly looking forward to this.

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Re: Format 14 cmap subtable

Postby vanisaac » Wed Oct 26, 2011 5:16 am

So what Cmap subtable formats does FCP support?

PS, if anyone needs to add a format 14 subtable to one of their fonts, send me a private message - I think I've found a tool that can do it.

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Re: Format 14 cmap subtable

Postby Erwin Denissen » Wed Oct 26, 2011 7:30 am

It supports all formats (format 0, 2, 4, 6, and 12) that are used by Windows for the purpose of the mapping of character codes to the glyph index values used in a font.

Format 14 is a special format as it specifies the Unicode Variation Sequences (UVSes) supported by a font.
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Re: Format 14 cmap subtable

Postby vanisaac » Wed Oct 26, 2011 9:12 am

Erwin Denissen wrote:It supports all formats (format 0, 2, 4, 6, and 12) that are used by Windows for the purpose of the mapping of character codes to the glyph index values used in a font.

Format 14 is a special format as it specifies the Unicode Variation Sequences (UVSes) supported by a font.


I was wondering specifically about format 13 range mapping, as I have been thinking about working on a last resort font, but am a bit surprised to see support for format 6, but not 10 - for those without the technical background, format 10 is the four-byte analogue to the two-byte trimmed table mappings of the format 6 subtable.

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Re: Format 14 cmap subtable

Postby Erwin Denissen » Wed Oct 26, 2011 11:03 am

Format 10 is not supported by Microsoft.
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Re: Format 14 cmap subtable

Postby vanisaac » Wed Oct 26, 2011 6:53 pm

Does Apple support the format 10 subtable?

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Re: Format 14 cmap subtable

Postby BabelStone » Thu Mar 17, 2016 1:00 pm

Hi Erwin,

Just checking back (after six years!) to see if you have any plans to support Format 14 cmap subtable any time soon. As you know, I use FontCreator a lot, and think it is the best, but the lack of support for Format 14 cmap subtable is something that really holds me back as several of my fonts need to support Unicode standardized variation sequences or ideographic variation sequences, and the only way these work under Windows is if the font has a Format 14 cmap subtable for them.

At present I have to export my fonts to text using the TTX font tool, then manually add in the Format 14 cmap subtable entries, and then export back to TTF, which is extremely tiresome and time-consuming. Please would you consider adding support for Format 14 cmap subtable as soon as possible, thanks!

Andrew

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Re: Format 14 cmap subtable

Postby Erwin Denissen » Fri Mar 18, 2016 4:13 pm

I'm not really familiar with this, so I wonder if you could suggest how the user interface should look?
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