Historical and Discretionary Ligatures

[steff_cioro_91]

Hello! I am working on a XVI hundred font (Garamond Gros Canon) wich have a variaty of historical and discreationary ligatures....At the time the letter s was written with the long s =( ſ ) that was place at the beginning of each word and in the middle, example= < ſancta ſanctorum > < Quouſque tandem abutere > the only exception the letter long s = ( ſ ) is written with normal s is at the end of each word, example < Luſus ſerius >

My question is wich script can I use in order to have this setting? I tried to add a new command in the "terminal form" (in the Opentype designer scripts) but it doesn't work, but it has a similar comand for the greek final Sigma (σ, ς) wich has the same rules: at the beginning and in the middle of the word <σ> and at the end of the word <ς> <ασυμβίβαστος> aſymbibaſtos

I added a pic in the attachments for reference.

Please help me how to proceed if it is possible,
Stefan from Italy

Screenshot 2024-02-08 114620.png (1.26 MiB) Viewed 14417 times

[Bhikkhu Pesala]

You have the right idea. You just need to add an entry to Terminal Forms (fina) for longs > s; and the Historical Forms must precede Terminal forms in the OpenType script.

Terminal form longs.png (5.03 KiB) Viewed 14409 times

Historical Forms Enabled

historical forms.png (9.33 KiB) Viewed 14409 times

Historical Forms and Terminal Forms Enabled

terminal forms.png (9.58 KiB) Viewed 14409 times

[steff_cioro_91]

Hi. Yes I tried.....but it changes only in the middle (long s) ....at the end it does not change with normal s...

[Bhikkhu Pesala]

You have not enabled the Terminal Forms (fina) feature. Both fina and hist need to be enabled.

[MikeW]

Hello! I am working on a XVI hundred font (Garamond Gros Canon) wich have a variaty of historical and discreationary ligatures....At the time the letter s was written with the long s =( ſ ) that was place at the beginning of each word and in the middle, example= < ſancta ſanctorum > < Quouſque tandem abutere > the only exception the letter long s = ( ſ ) is written with normal s is at the end of each word, example < Luſus ſerius >

My question is wich script can I use in order to have this setting? I tried to add a new command in the "terminal form" (in the Opentype designer scripts) but it doesn't work, but it has a similar comand for the greek final Sigma (σ, ς) wich has the same rules: at the beginning and in the middle of the word <σ> and at the end of the word <ς> <ασυμβίβαστος> aſymbibaſtos...

Do note that in most periods of time, a long /s is not used in the middle of a word. For instance, a normal /s is used preceding and followuing an /f.

The fina OT Feature, when setup, can/will only change the final /s. As well, it is a feature that is not broadly supported in and of itself.

One really should use the more broadly supported Chaining Context feature and set "Rules" for the different contexts for when and is an /s changes to a long /s.

If interested, I've attached a paper written for these rules of long /s use.

Mike

Long S Example.pdf

(55.67 KiB) Downloaded 554 times

[steff_cioro_91]

Hi...how can I set a Chaining Context feature with rules? ( I am still learning the software) My project is set for a revival and wish to be as accurate historicaly as possibile...thanks for the pdf!

[MikeW]

Hi...how can I set a Chaining Context feature with rules? ( I am still learning the software) My project is set for a revival and wish to be as accurate historicaly as possibile...thanks for the pdf!

Just a note. One cannot account for every rule of every period. So I would also suggest reading about the long /s usage as typeset around the period of your revival. Even then, one likely cannot account for every rule. Some usage may then be up to the layout person to catch these instances and manually make usage comply.

Contextual type of OT Features take trial and error. For instance, the order in which rules are processed by layout engines (applications) matters. Which is one reason why not all of the customs of the writing period can be accommodated.

Here are two screen shots. First, a rule from the PDF followed by the context rule that makes the text comply.

Capture_001145.png (19.41 KiB) Viewed 14347 times

Capture_001144.png (72.56 KiB) Viewed 14347 times

I added these rules this morning--for short /s preceding /b, /h, /k, /t. I haven't really retested the font to make sure I didn't break the other rules from being correctly processed. Nor have I tested to ensure I didn't break the ability to also turn on historical ligatures. All this to say, you also need to test, test and test your font in as many applications that purport to support these features.

[steff_cioro_91]

Oh! thank you! I will try and see results! will post screen then