MIA Apostrophe chars in CFF/OT fonts, not only one?

[Hitch]

Hi:

I know that this is the HL forum, and not the "all sorts of weird font-related issues" support hub, but...don't really know where else to turn at this time. I was recently seeking a display font for a customer. I was doing some mockup work in MSFT Publisher, which is quick-n-dirty for me, compared to INDD (when I'm doing font searches and layouts). I used two fonts, one called "LateFall-Floral" (Open Type CFF) and one named "Hello Paris Serif Regular" (ditto). I don't recall exactly where I obtained these two fonts when I did, but 99% of the time, I bought from typical commercial sources like Myfonts.com, Creative Market, or the usual; I know that neither was some freebie download from some fly-by-night site.

When this first occurred, I tested it in MSFT Word, thinking initially that it was a Publisher issue, and nope, they don't appear there (Word) and wait for it--here's the kicker--they don't appear in InDesign, EITHER. The glyph appears in the INDD glyph panel (see attached). But not on the page.

I just realized that neither of them will display the " (double-quotes) in INDD, either. Yes, both have the apostrophe encoded as 0x27; all of that seems fine. I've been trying to develop a proof block to check for everything else, character-wise, but until a moment ago, it had appeared to solely be the apostrophe (now includes the typical double-quote in INDD, at least, but that DOES work in Word/Publisher!). Other fonts seem to be working fine, but I haven't checked all of them, of course. Like many, I have thousands of typefaces and fonts and I have no great way to test them all.

I've tried this and that but so far, nothing seems to solve it. Oh, one update--I've used these fonts previously without issues. HOWEVER, I just switched over from a Win10 box to a Win11 box, in the last two weeks. If there's any clue there.

Any ideas, anybody? As to where to even start? I do a ton of font work and if by some magical weirdness of the odds, it's ONLY these two fonts, fine...I'll just trash them and live without them but what are the odds that it's only these two OT-CFFs? Pretty bad odds, I should think. And, when I thought (wrongly) that it was "only" MSFT/Word, that was one thing but INDD? I'd be screwed. (And what are the odds that I somehow managed to casually select the only two faces in my collection that don't work? Yeah, that's what I think too.)

Any and all thoughts and ideas welcome. So weird. Again, sorry to just leap in here with a not-HL issue but...I really have no idea what to do about this or how to address it. Mods, if I've broken the rules, mea culpa, just...delete the post, I guess.

Thanks,
Clancy

[Bhikkhu Pesala]

Try disabling Autocorrect. The font probably lacks the “curly quotes” found in Miscellaneous Punctuation.

[Hitch]

Try disabling Autocorrect. The font probably lacks the “curly quotes” found in Miscellaneous Punctuation.

Thanks--when I read your post, I thought, duh, that's brilliant, that must be it--but alas, it's not. I disabled autocorrect in both Word and in INDD and neither showed a single iota of difference. No apostrophes, no double quotes (You are right that neither has curly quotes, for, in case there's a clue in there someplace).

What's bizarre is, I am 99.99% sure that I used both of these with Win10 and never had an issue but I'll boot up the Win10 box later and make sure I'm not lying (inadvertently, obviously). Dammit.

Clancy

[Hitch]

UPDATE:

Weirder and weirder. Hello Paris Serif Regular is now "working" on INDD; (nope, I didn't do or change a single thing; I don't use autocorrect in the first place in INDD and yes, I double-checked). I can insert the chars from the glyphs panel AND type them (' and ") from the keyboard. However, Late Fall is not--I can insert the char from the glyph panel, yes--but not from the keyboard. I'm going to go find some other OT-CFF and see if it has issues, too; maybe something that does have curlies as well as straights, see if that MIGHT play any part. I hate inconsistencies, I really do.

What the hell is this stuff? GRRRR....

BTW, I forgot to thank you for being gracious enough to take the time, on a holiday weekend, to even look at this post, which isn't really about HL, much less answer it. Thank you for that.

(For those that observe it):

༶･･ᗰદ૨૨ʏ ᘓમ૨ıડτന੨ડ･･༶

Clancy

[Bhikkhu Pesala]

I am a Buddhist monk. Christmas is pretty much the same as any other day for me.

I tested the curly quotes on My Fonts. Late Fall Floral seems to be missing the double quotes.

Late Fall Floral.png (15.58 KiB) Viewed 2992 times

Hello Paris.png (24.87 KiB) Viewed 2992 times

[Hitch]

Howdy:

I am a Buddhist monk. Christmas is pretty much the same as any other day for me.

Okay, that's pretty cool. I am aware that not everybody celebrates the same holidays, which is why I mentioned "for those who observe it..." but sure, I still appreciate great customer service on a "regular" Sunday, too!

I tested the curly quotes on My Fonts. Late Fall Floral seems to be missing the double quotes.

In the Late Fall Floral, did you notice (I'm sure you did), that it seems to have curlies at locations here (this is immediately adjacent to the apostrophe glyph); then there's another glyph, another closing quotation mark, also curly, as the very last glyph in the font. Unicode 34, it says. Attached that one too. I mean, a pic of it FWIW. (With "uni-34" in the filename for easy finding.)

Hello Paris Serif Regular seems to have curlies, if you can call them that. Little stubby chubby ones, but...is it me, or do neither of these fonts appear to have any opening quotes at all? Am I behind the curve here? I would have sworn that my usuals like foundry fonts (Adobe Garamond, let's say) have a) straight quotes and b) straight apostrophes in the base set, and then b) the curlies in the General Punctuation area, AND c) they have opening and closing, yes? I don't pretend to be some typeface/font-creation expert, I'm not by any means, but I do use typography a LOT and I'm a bit befuddled to see typefaces with solely closing curlies. Unless I somehow missed them....I mean, if you're creating a closing dbl-quote mark, why the heck are you NOT doing the openers????

I swear, this is weirder and weirder.

Clancy

[Bhikkhu Pesala]

There is a Unicode standard for good reason, but not all fonts follow it. Remove non-standard fonts from your system to avoid such issues, or contact the font designer and ask them to fix it.

[Hitch]

There is a Unicode standard for good reason, but not all fonts follow it. Remove non-standard fonts from your system to avoid such issues, or contact the font designer and ask them to fix it.

Yeah, I don't see many alternatives. This is irking me. I mean, these weren't freebies or fly-by-nights, etc. They're hardly my favorites, but I acquired them through client requests some years back--2-3 years, I think, when there oughtn't be any excuse for this. Damn.

Thanks for looking. Now I'm going to have to test every bloody CFF/OT font to see if they're standard. I do buy CM (Creative Market) and the like, fonts, because I've not had any real problems with them previously. This caught me by surprise, and to have it happen, through what seems to be sheer coincidence, in the same document (test mockup, I mean!), one after the other is pretty bizarre.

For those who come along and read this and are not Buddhist Monks, Merry Christmas and Happy Hanukkah! And for those of you that are, thank you for your efforts to help me--they are truly appreciated.

Clancy